Welcome to a special edition of Shitbox Showdown — one in which the cars have been chosen by none other than our illustrious Editor-In-Chief himself, David Tracy. How did that transpire? We’ll get to that in a second. First let’s see how our Euro-trash cars did yesterday:
No surprise there. The convertible, manual Saab walked away with a comfortable win. The automatic Peugeot, when asked to comment on the loss, merely shrugged, lit up a Gitanes, and muttered something about Americans not knowing a good car if it bit them on the… well, anyway. Congratulations to the Saab!
But back to David’s dilemma. Here’s what happened: On Sunday evening, while I was cooking up a pot of Juila Child’s famous potato-leek soup, I received a cryptic email from David. The subject line said simply “Please Help Me!” and the message was nothing more than listings for two cars for sale. Curiously, neither of them were Jeeps.
Now, I wasn’t there, but I can imagine how this message came about: David, after a long day performing a differential diagnosis on a junkyard ZJ (you’ll be reading more about that later today), dozed off on the couch watching reruns of old Barrett-Jackson auctions. When he awoke, he had an epiphany – and a snack. In a Hot Pocket-fueled frenzy, he started looking up non-Jeeps for sale, realizing that he may have been selling the rest of the automotive universe short. He soon found himself in over his head, and in a panic, reached out to the first knowledgeable non-Jeep enthusiast he knew who wasn’t currently high on powderized taillight lenses: me. How could I refuse?
It’s okay, David. We’re here to help. Put down the timing light – slowly! – and we can talk.
So here, bewilderingly, are the two listings he sent me:
1982 Ford Thunderbird – $1700
Engine/drivetrain: 4.2 liter V8, automatic, RWD
Odometer reading: 125,000 miles
Location: Sterling Heights, MI
Runs/drives: Not currently; has been sitting in a garage for 8 years
Wow. What can I say about the ’82 Thunderbird that hasn’t been said before? Probably quite a lot, actually. I don’t think anyone has given these a second thought since Hart to Hart went off the air. [Editor’s note: Once again, I have no idea what this reference means. -DT]. The severely downsized eighth-generation ‘bird was only around for three years, and was not a sales success, to put it mildly. Coming at the tail end of peak-personal luxury coupe, this car was a dinosaur from day one, even though it rode on Ford’s relatively modern Fox platform. Ford lavished every bit of baroque ’70s styling they could think of on the new fun-size Thunderbird, and no one cared.
At least this one is a V8, though it’s also downsized, coming in at only 255 cubic inches. This stopgap lump fortunately only stuck around a couple of years, worming its way under the hoods of various Fox-platform cars, and, worryingly, a few F-150s. It spins a relatively stout AOD four-speed automatic in this car, and it probably could manage the bank-beauty salon-grocery store-home circuit well enough.
Overall, this Thunderbird doesn’t look awful. There is some rust, and some of it is in troubling locations, which may warrant further investigation. The interior, however, in true malaise-era coupe fashion, is glorious. If there’s anything better bolted to a car floor than cushy velour seats as soft as a good Barcalounger, I haven’t found it.
The 1982 Thunderbird also marks the first appearance of what has become a Ford signature: the five-button keyless entry keypad. And of course, there are those cool vacuum-operated hidden headlights, open on this car because I’m sure the vacuum that held them closed leaked out of the system ages ago.
Is it worth a full restoration? Hell no. Can you at least perform some hot-rod magic on that little Windsor V8 and make it purr? Nope, too many unique parts; you’d have to swap it for a more conventional 302. Would it be fun to revive and cruise around in as-is? Probably. Is it worth David’s time? That’s for you to decide.
1964 Chevrolet Corvair Monza Sedan – $3700
Engine/drivetrain: 2.7 liter air-cooled flat 6, 4 speed manual, RWD
Odometer reading: 56,000 miles
Location: Eastpointe, MI
Runs/drives: Nope. Carbs are not installed.
One of the most famous “failures” in all of automotive history, the Chevy Corvair has been unfairly picked on its entire life. Some of the criticism was valid, of course – the reliability troubles of a completely new and untested platform, the unusual handling of a rear-engine car with a swing-axle suspension, and a voracious oil appetite gave the early models a reputation for trouble. And then there was that 1965 book that I won’t discuss, because the poor Corvair deserves some attention on its own merits for once.
The Corvair did pretty well in the showroom prior to Unsafe at any Speed; this 1964 model is one of 215,000 Corvairs sold that year. And the “Monza” version, with more power and a four-speed stick, was the one to have, even in 4 door sedan form like this. Being a ’64, it also benefits from suspension improvements in the form of a front anti-roll bar and a transverse leaf spring at the rear, both intended to quell the Corvair’s tail-happy tendencies, as well as new valve stem seals to help slake its thirst for oil.
This particular Corvair looks, well, pretty damn nice. The black interior is in great shape (it should be, with only 56,000 miles) and goes well with that butter-yellow paint. Those headlight rock guards are killing me. I just love them. And it has the best of all possible gear knobs: a plain white ball.
There is some engine work to be done before David could enjoy the view over that hood, though. The carburetors (there are two) are not installed, and it isn’t clear why not. A rebuild of both carbs is likely in order, and then there is the arduous process of tuning a twin-carb engine, which in itself is worth some gearhead cred once complete.
It should be noted that this car is well outside our normal price cutoff of $2500, but since the listing came from David, I have no qualms about suspending that rule just this once. And really, this car, for $3700, even with some engine assembly required, seems like a hell of a deal. But it is more than twice as much as the Thunderbird.
And there you have it. I don’t pretend to be an expert when it comes to either of these cars, but I hope I have been able to shed some light on them for a guy whose automotive landscape consists of “Jeep” and “Other.” Now talk amongst yourselves, and determine which one looks like a better choice.
The T-Bird would probably be the easiest to fix, but it’s boring. The Corvair is an interesting car, and that one looks to be in good shape. My great aunt had that gen of T-Bird, and it wasn’t that impressive of a car. Very malaise era slug.
Also, I’m very offended by this line: “reached out to the first knowledgeable non-Jeep enthusiast he knew who wasn’t currently high on powderized taillight lenses…” This kind of drug reference to Torch’s taillight obsession is out of line. There’s no way that he’d grind up a taillight to snort it. I picture Torch as more of a Cronenberg-esque body horror situation with taillights grafted onto his human frame.
I’m sure the Corvair is gonna walk away with this one, but I’ll take the thunder chicken. It’s suck a ripe platform to be modded and the interior is glorious. It’s make one helluva cool cruise with a few we’ll placed mods.
After years of lurking on auto websites, I can’t believe this is the article that actually got me to register and comment. I love the corvair but would love to see the Thunderbird built into a Dale Earnhardt or Bill Elliot nascar tribute.
And now you’ve got a ‘like’ to boot. Autopian is quickly replacing the other site as my go-to for car stuff. The content here has been fantastic so far.
I don’t see the option to vote…Haven’t since day 1.
Anyway, Corvair all day.
Check your ad blocking. I also was missing it until I whitelisted the site.
I voted Corvair, but I really should have voted against buying.
David, we need to get you watching TV, going to concerts, or even just talking to other human beings. Something other than constantly working on cars might allow you to pick up on a cultural reference or two (I was relieved you understood the recent Toto reference, at least, but that one was basically a freebie).
Obviously, I’m biased, but, if that Corvair is as good cosmetically as it appears in the pictures, and just needs carbs to get running, then that is a solid buy, you’d come out ahead financially, or at least roughly break even.
I voted Corvair.
My real vote would be to keep the 4Door Valiant… Does DT still have that? Or did he sell it? Hard to keep track.
This isn’t even fair. There is nothing good about that Thunderbird. You can’t even make good things up about it. Its only redeeming quality was hideaway headlights and they’re probably broken to the point where repair would cost more than the value of the car. This car will forever be worth a multiple less than 1 of the value of its constituent scrap metal.
Alternatively you have the Corvair, which is actually cool and would appreciate in value over the next decade merely by parking it in enclosed storage.
Nothing good about that T-bird? Sir, did you *see* that interior?
See it? I can smell it through the picture.
Corvair wins this one. I like fox bodies, but that one… just no
I’m still rooting for David to buy an SA or FB RX-7 next, but a Corvair would be a good substitute!
Absolutely the Corvair – so I get to see a Corvair any time I drive by on the way to mom’s house.
If it were a two-door I’d say Corvair even louder – that way I could buy it off him for even less when he sells it in a year.
Corvair
Have to go with the TBird. The Corvair is not a shitbox.
Buuuuut, the Corvair needs assembly and carb tuning. It could be a nightmare, which he would find attractive.
As a former Corvair owner, normally I would recommend the Thunderbird. It’s Foxbody underpinnings mean that lots of crossover parts are available, so replacing that engine with a 302 isn’t that crazy. Plus, getting those hideaway headlights to function again would be a sight to behold.
However…
You’re an engineer, David. It’s time for you to buy a Corvair. ’64 is definitely a desirable year for early Corvair enthusiasts because of the aforementioned transverse leaf spring. It’s the best of the early ‘vairs, even though it wasn’t available with the oil heater like the ’60. It will challenge your inner engineer in ways you just haven’t thought about yet.
Expect to reseal push rod tubes… and be prepared for any of the 240+ other locations where the engine (a pair of steel-aluminum-steel sandwiches) will leak oil. Having fun balancing those carbs. Clean those fins out and keep the engine covers on and still deal with vapor lock. And first things first, MOVE THAT SPARE TIRE TO THE FRONT. In the back, you want to make sure it’s underinflated lest the engine heat cause it to explode all over the place and get chopped up into fine bits by the fan. My Corvair had tire bits all over the engine bay from unknown years ago.
Keep two extra fan belts with you and the two wrenches needed to change them out. The fan belt takes a 90-degree bend from the pulley to reach the fan and they were prone to randomly flying off and getting chopped up by the aforementioned fan. Be prepared to jump out of your car and occasionally check to see if the fan belt is still there. The alternators (or generators) had a habit of motoring off the battery so that the GEN light wouldn’t necessarily come on if you lost your belt.
This is the challenge you’ve been waiting for. Drive it. Daily it. (I dailied mine. It was ill-advised). And enjoy your encounters with Corvair fans. All of mine went like this:
“Is that a Corvair?”
“Yes.”
“I had a Corvair when I was in (high school/college/middle age)! I loved that car! I had so much fun in it! It blew up.”
Everything you just wrote made me have to have one
Former Corvair owner here, there are many aftermarket fan guides available that totally eliminate the problem of belts slipping off. Many local Corvair Clubs have the blueprints to make your own. They’ve been around since the late sixties.
T-bird all day but goodness I hope poor David isn’t actually buying another project.
I assume the Fox underpinnings of the T-Bird are the main reason it’s getting any votes at all. I personally wouldn’t touch it.
The Corvair is the obvious choice assuming DT actually has the sense not to be buying one of these things. That Corvair looks like a nice car for the money.
Can’t fault any of those who took door #3, though.
Um…do you SEE that interior?!
David, just think of all the fun (and posts) you’d have scouring Detroit’s collection of Fox-platformed cars in every junkyard to find the perfect 302, Tremec 5-spd, Eibach springs. The fun (and posts) of converting an auto-tragic car to a manual.
Don’t give in to peer pressure!
Find your own path!
Win one for the Kipper!
I think this situation absolutely requires a really futile and stupid gesture be done on somebody’s part. You’re just the guy to do it…LET’S DO IT!
The interior is exactly why I chose the Corvair for you. Remember when you sold the Lexus because it was “too nice” for you? That T-Bird is WAY too nice for you. Plus its and auto, and you’re just not an auto kind of guy.
The Corvair, however, has all kinds of bizarre engineering details for you to nerd out on.
But please please PLEASE! Sell at lease four Jeeps before buy anything. Preferably 5 or 6.
The T-bird isn’t that nice. Did you see the photo of the windshield frame/A-pillar rust?
You just said ‘rust’. To DT that’s like sitting out a cartoon pie on the window sill to let the stent become animated, grow hands, and pick up the nearby hobo and glide them through the air to it.
Of course we see the interior, and it is glorious – if you are gonna park the car, put an entertainment system into it, and use it for a tiny living room. If you wanna use it as a CAR, then the Corvair is the only correct answer here.
growing up with a car with dual carbs I am not prepared to deal with them at all this many years later but also remember the satisfaction of them just working well after dealing with them. I have only had anywhere between 1 and 5 cars/motorcycles at the same time so I am not the expert David is but also am not ready for him to stop buying crap yet
Air-cooled Rear-engined manual? I think the whole world would say that’s the right choice. Bo-ring.
No one loves those T-birds and that interior deserves to be saved. T-bird all day. I anxiously await the series of articles wherein DT combines a go-devil with some flavor of the holy grail 4.0 I-6 and then makes it work in this Fox Body.
He’s going to Australia, so maybe some flavour of Ford I6 would be the perfect souvenir?
There is a Fox-Body Mustang that’s had a Barra swap, making this lounge act into a 12-second sleeper or faster would be kinda cool.
“making this lounge act into a 12-second sleeper or faster would be kinda cool.”
Even getting it to 60MPH in 12s from a stop would be an improvement.
Love me that velour though.
There is some good aura around this Corvair, the color is good, the interior is good, the manual is good and the roof overhang is a cool feature, wasn’t aware of it until now.
Yeah, that roofline on the early Corvair sedans is just a work of art. The coupes get all the attention, but they don’t have that little detail.
Argh, stupid Facebook Marketplace listings… photos no workie. The links both work, however, if y’all want to actually see the cars.
just the main cover pic of the Corvair, no other pics showed, so had to go with Dude needs to stop buying cars.
I can appreciate a good Corvair, but… meh
The T-Bird has the Fox body under it, swap in good handling stuff and a good engine and go.
I had completely forgotten about the fox T-bird. That interior is AWESOME! Rest of the car not so much…
I don’t want either of those, so I picked David needs to stop buying crap. However, in hindsight, I’d prolly take the Corvair home
As of this moment, 100% of all the responses say buy the Corvair.
Yes, to be technical, I am the only one who has voted so far. But still. Buy the Corvair.