We’ve got a more expensive F-150 EV, a NHTSA investigation into Cruise, a Faraday Future update, it’s dark, and we’re wearing sunglasses. Hit it!
Welcome to The Morning Dump, bite-sized stories corralled into a single article for your morning perusal. If your morning coffee’s working a little too well, pull up a throne and have a gander at the best of the rest of yesterday.
The Base F-150 Lightning Now Costs $56,000 (+$1,895)
Car companies have learned that they can launch a car with an extremely low price, grab a lot of headlines, and then quickly raise that price and just face a few headlines like this. So here we go: Ford is increasing the price of the base (Pro) F-150 Lightning electric truck to $55,974 (+$1,895). If this feels like deja vu this is because this isn’t the first time this has happened.
The folks over at Electrek have been keeping track:
When Ford announced pricing for the F-150 Lightning, it surprised many with a starting price of $40,000. It appears to aim to compete with Tesla’s Cybertruck base price announced a few years prior.
However, the price didn’t last long.
In August, Ford increased the price of all the models by $6,000 to $8,000.
Then again, just a few months ago in October, Ford increased the base price of the F-150 Lightning to $52,000 this time.
This isn’t the only increase. The standard range XLT got bumped to $63,474, up from $59,474. Both of these prices exclude the $1,895 destination charge.
[Ed note: This happens to lots of vehicles. The 2023 Jeep Wrangler’s price just jumped over $1,000 for no additional content. Maddening. -DT]
If you’ve already put in an order and are awaiting delivery, your price is safe. The same thing happened to the Maverick and it’s just a reminder that, if you really want a car, there are some advantages to putting in the order as soon as you can.
The Feds Are Probing Cruise Self-Driving Vehicles
There have been multiple instances of crashes and immobilized Cruise vehicles in San Francisco lately. Welcome to the future, where a car with no driver parks behind another car with no driver and just sits there. The National Highway Traffic Safety Administration has had enough and has launched a probe into Cruise’s operations, according to Reuters reporter David Shepardson.
Cruise said it has “driven nearly 700,000 fully autonomous miles in an extremely complex urban environment with zero life-threatening injuries or fatalities…. There’s always a balance between healthy regulatory scrutiny and the innovation we desperately need to save lives, which is why we’ll continue to fully cooperate with NHTSA or any regulator in achieving that shared goal.”
NHTSA said it plans to fully assess the potential safety-related issues posed by these two types of incidents and will review “the commonality and safety logic of the hard braking incidents” and the “frequency, duration and safety consequences associated with the vehicle immobilization incidents.”
Last month, Cruise Chief Operating Officer Gil West told Reuters the company plans to enter a “large number of markets” and scale operations up to “thousands of vehicles” in 2023.
There’s this great scene in “The Magnificent Ambersons” wherein one of the characters is driving an extremely early automobile, with its seemingly endless problems and off-putting noise. When people see the horseless carriage driving down the street (or broken down) they jeer and yell “Get a horse!”
By the time Booth Tarkington wrote the novel, in 1917, the cars had won and the horses had lost. That moment will probably come for driverless cars and the question is always: How long will that be? Seems like it’s going to be a while to me, but maybe in a decade I’ll look back on me yelling “Get a driver!” and laugh at my pessimism.
Faraday Future Is Going To Deliver Cars In April, According To Faraday Future
It should be clear at this point that The Autopian maintains a great deal of skepticism towards troubled EV company Faraday Future. I refer you to: “Faraday Future Continues To Produce More Drama Than Actual Cars” and “Controversial Chinese Billionaire Will Try To Save EV Company That Spent $3 Billion And Hasn’t Delivered A Car.”
This is one of those situations where it would be nice to be wrong. I’ve actually met a couple of Faraday Future employees and they seem quite smart and believe in a lot of what the company is doing, technologically. In the spirit of optimism and Christmas and Saturnalia and all that, I’ll share some of their updates:
Anticipated start of production of FF 91 Futurist at FF’s manufacturing facility “FF ieFactory California” at the end of March 2023, coming off the assembly line in early April, deliveries to users anticipated to begin April 2023, subject to timely receipt of additional financing and stockholder approval
On that last key piece:
Engaged in discussions with both potential new investors and existing FF investors to provide the estimated $150-170M of additional capital needed to produce the FF 91 Futurist
The Company has received a draft $30 million binding letter of intent from a current FF investor, which remains subject to Board approval and certain conditions including the negotiation and execution of definitive documentation
Fingers crossed!
The Chicago Auto Show Is Back, Baby!
My first ever auto show as a professional member of the media was the Chicago Auto Show. I essentially bluffed my way into a press pass from Ray Wert. It was great fun and changed my life. It was a little less fun for Ray and Mike Spinelli as they suddenly had an enthusiastic kid in his early 20s running around and annoying everyone in the press room with his constant loud chatter [Ed Note: Some things never change. -DT]. They got over it.
Even in the peak era of auto shows, Chicago was never the place where the biggest news was broken, but it was always the biggest place where news was broken. Set inside the city’s cavernous McCormick Place, the show won on sheer acreage. It was gigantic. The pandemic led to the show shrinking a bit but now it’s back to full-size! From their release:
The Chicago Automobile Trade Association (CATA), producer of the Chicago Auto Show, today announced it will reopen the north exhibit hall of McCormick Place, expanding once again to a two-hall show and reenlisting brands that missed during the pandemic. The 2023 show, Feb. 11-20, is positioned to be the most experiential Chicago Auto Show yet, offering outdoor ride-and-drives as well as a handful of brand-new indoor test tracks including a 100,000 sq.-ft. destination featuring EV test drives and education, called Chicago Drives Electric.
[…]
Additionally, the 2023 show will bring back fan-favorite events that took a backseat during the pandemic including Chicago Friday Night Flights, a local craft beer sampling event, and the Toyota Miles Per Hour run, where runners can experience the auto show via a 2.4-mile loop inside McCormick Place before the event doors open to the general public.
“Whether you’re interested in running or sipping your way around the show, are an auto enthusiast, or simply in the market to shop and see what’s new, there’s truly something for everyone at the 2023 Chicago Auto Show,” Keefe added.
I lived in Chicago and the two things I remember distinctly are:
- Exercising outside was impossible for what felt like eight months of the year.
- It’s the drinkiest place I’ve ever been.
Somehow, they auto show has addressed both of these issues at once! Amazing!
The Flush
When it comes to buying new cars (or new anything) are you a fast-mover or a waiter? Were you the first person to get an iPhone or did you let the bugs get worked out first?
- Elon Musk Sells $3.6 Billion In Tesla Stock
- The Volvo XC40 and Escape are the only two SUVs that did well on new IIHS test
- The men who helped Carlos Ghosn escape had a far worse fate
- The 2023 Subaru WRX Miraculously Only Costs $31,625
- Used car prices keep falling as inflation finally cools
Got a hot tip? Send it to us here. Or check out the stories on our homepage.
Photos: Ford, Faraday Future, Chicago Auto Show, Cruise
I’m generally a cheapskate when it comes to things like phones ($150 Moto G Power), computers (7 year old $300 laptop), and clothes (Old Navy and Beall’s Outlet), but my car was my retirement gift, and I hadn’t owned a car for 36 years (NYC).
So I bought exactly what I wanted, which was a brand new generation of a car built in a brand new factory in a country that didn’t build the brand before.
Not that it was crazy expensive though: 2015 Honda Fit, VIN sub 5K, now 8.5 years old, and I still absolutely love it. I have no intention of trading it, probably ever. It’s been flawless.
Hell Yeah on the Chicago Auto Show! I used to go there regularly starting in the late 90’s through the mid to late 2000’s when a new house, kid, and that pesky financial crisis put the pinch on the fun-budget. Used to stay at whatever I-55 exit past Joliet had the White Castle. Saw so many cool cars there in person – the Cadillac 16, the XLR, the Cien, GM’s Hy-wire concept, the first year of the GT40, a bunch of high-end German sedans I’d never be allowed near at a dealership, the 1st year PT Cruisers you had to be on a waiting list in order to buy (say that again just to wrap your head around it), etc. Since I like to both run and drink beer, maybe 2023 will finally mark the return of that trip!
One for the waiters: the latest-gen GTI launched with those three maligned capacitive swipe bars. The second year, 2023, and mine has no swipe bars and added back some dials and buttons.
“Were you the first person to get an iPhone or did you let the bugs get worked out first?”
I didn’t get an iPhone until the 3G came out. But my Lightning has a sub 9k VIN.
I don’t think this is really comparable though. The first iPhone was the first phone that Apple ever made, and it couldn’t do things that existing smartphones could do yet. There were no apps!
Ford makes trucks already, and this isn’t even their first successful EV. They’ve been crushing it with the “Mustang” for a while now. I might have the approximately 9000th Lightning, but they’ve made close to 100,000 other EVs before mine. And they seem to be pretty good at it. It’s not like the early Teslas. Other than a few trivial software glitches the quality has been spot on.
That said, and as much as I love my truck, and though I should “consider myself lucky to have gotten to pay 2022 sticker price” for it, I think it was too expensive for what it is. I think that unless you got a 2022 Pro at MSRP, every trim was too was expensive for what it is even at 2022 prices. These new prices are absolutely insane.
I’m a waiter. The first model year of almost every car is the one with the biggest/most problems. Waiting until year two or three is absolutely the way to go. Hype has probably died down a bit and the kinks have been worked out.
“It’s the drinkiest place I’ve ever been.”
Wisconsin would like a word…
“[Ed note: This happens to lots of vehicles. The 2023 Jeep Wrangler’s price just jumped over $1,000 for no additional content. Maddening. -DT]”
Yes. This is called ‘profiteering.’ It’s a symptom of end-stage capitalism.
“There’s always a balance between healthy regulatory scrutiny and the innovation we desperately need to save lives,”
Translation: we are so fucking lying, we’re all lying, and it’s no fair that the mean government agency tasked with keeping people safe and alive is investigating us for doing the opposite. Making us play by rules is stifling innovation!
Fuck off, Cruze. Fuck all the way off.
“It should be clear at this point that The Autopian maintains a great deal of skepticism towards troubled EV company Faraday Future.”
As does anybody with more than 70 uncontested IQ points.
Wonder why that is…
When it comes to buying new cars (or new anything) are you a fast-mover or a waiter? Were you the first person to get an iPhone or did you let the bugs get worked out first?
Depends on the car. Jeep Grand Cherokee WL with the 5.7/850RE combination? Basically zero concerns aside from infotainment. It’s a beyond proven drivetrain, it’s on the Giorgio platform, nothing aside from screens and nicer materials is new. (And doesn’t have to be.)
Kia Stinger? I absolutely sat out consideration of first year. Even though I was very impressed with the fit, finish, and quality. Because the 3.3GDi twin turbo was new, the transmission was new, the platform was new, the infotainment was new, it was all new stuff with no track record. And sure, you’ve got warranty to cover you. But then they realize there’s an engineering defect that they can only fix for next model year, it shortens the lifespan significantly, and you’re holding the bag.
Oh, I wait. That’s how I took advantage of the neglect Ford has for small cars and got a brand new 2018 Ford Fiesta ST out the door for under $20k (in California, no less – land of high registration fees and sales tax pushing 9%).
I am very much a Waiter. Partly because I am a cheap bastard and would rather have 5 old junkers than one pristine new car. I have also gotten pretty good with diagnosing and repairing carbs and points-type ignition systems so I can’t let that skill go to waste!
This. I mean, that dwell meter can’t just sit there collecting dust, can it?
best way to repair points ignition is replace it with Pertronix electric ignition.
New…… car…… ??? Would someone please explain how that works?
Closest I’ve ever come to New is 10 years old and that was too soon. Current stable is 22 year old bike, 27 year old jeep, and 54 year old truck.
People: Can I get a $40K F-150 Lightning
Ford: $46,000 DOLLARS? Why pay only $48,000 when $52,000 will do? Here’s thousands in mandatory accessories and a $20K+ dealer markup, ENJOY!
“The 2023 show, Feb. 11-20, is positioned to be the most experiential Chicago Auto Show yet, offering outdoor ride-and-drives”
Outdoor in Chicago in February? That seems like a terrible idea, unless they’re intending it to be in the snow and/or freezing cold.
The lines and everything are inside, and there’s a network of underground roads, freight entrances, etc beneath McCormick so you’re safe from weather while getting in and out of the cars.
Some of the actual driving might be in poor conditions, which is actually a benefit IMO to see how the cars handle it.
At least for the past several years that I’ve been going to it, the automakers seem keep the test drives on a loop that stays largely under the McCormick Place structure. You might see daylight for like a minute and that’s it. lol
Maybe they’re changing that to attract more people!
Came here for this.
…and now I see the replies…
When it comes to new cars I’d say I’m in between. There are absolutely advantages to being able to make a move and put money down quickly, particularly in this bonkers market. If you genuinely love a car, are confident it’ll meet your expectations after research and a test drive, and aren’t going to be stretching yourself financially to own it it’s better to move quickly.
HOWEVER…you also need to be able to walk away. Otherwise dealerships won’t hesitate to pull shenanigans on you…be it adding a damn markup, or a $2,000 ClEaR cOaT, or offering you a lousy deal off the bat, et cetera. At the end of the day unless you’re trying to buy a unicorn there’s going to be another (insert car here)…and I personally think it’s best to be flexible on color and options so you don’t pigeonhole yourself and become an easier target.
If you walk away from a sale you have all the power. I had a deposit in on my Kona N and fell in love with it after the test drive…but the finance numbers they threw at me initially were whack given my credit, so I said “I’ll sleep on it” and went home. That night I poked around the interweb for deals, and voila…a deal for better financing on the Kona N popped up on the dealer’s own site.
I screen capped it, texted it to my salesman, said “make this happen and we have a deal”, and picked up the car the next day. Was it a risk letting the car sit unsold for an extra night? Eh. Maybe? Possibly? But I wound up with $500 off MSRP and financing that was a full 1-2% lower than what had been quoted to me initially so…worth it!
Be ready to move, but don’t be a sucker.
I guess I’m kind of in between too. I’m not a fast mover, but tend to be impulsive once my mind is made up. I’m unlikely to get a reservation or on waiting list for a car, but could decide spur of the moment to make a change. But that’s more me being fortunate and having the freedom to do that if I so choose – and knowing to walk away.
VW of America is not a fast mover, so by default that wasn’t really an option when I decided on a GTI. I seriously considered a 2017 when they were blowing them out, but was glad I held out for the 2018 for a few reasons.
– I had ~6 months left on a current lease – which gave me time to shop and not be impulsive
– VW changed the model/feature mix, added more/better colors – and held out for the color I wanted (hence the username) even though I was and am flexible on that like you said
– 6 year/72k warranty…which after a year I changed jobs and commuted much less, then a year after that the pandemic reduced that even further – so only at 33k miles, but still 2 more years on the warranty
Plus I was talking to several dealers and drove a couple hours for both the right car and deal, and had another in the same market with a similar deal as a backup – so made it a confident decision.
If I didn’t make stuff, I’d be a minimalist, so I’m not an early adopter type, but I have gotten two cars just as they started becoming available: 2012 Focus SE with a manual (proved to be a REALLY good choice) and GR86, which was in the first US allocation. Lucked out there. Time will tell if it has problems (nothing yet, though only 21k miles, so there shouldn’t be), but the Focus was bulletproof over 200k (unfortunately, not crash proof as 2 dinguses rear ended it) and just one quick recall for a software update related to being an early car. Of course, neither platform was all new, so I was taking a lesser risk.
must have been a silver Focus, they always get rearended for some reason. Good thing you did not opt for the Auto(ish) version.
“Were you the first person to get an iPhone or did you let the bugs get worked out first?”
I don’t have a cell phone but I am a geologist, so by my standards it’s far too soon to say whether this makes me a fast-mover or not.
You’re on the internet, browsing a site about cars. That’s pretty fast. I’ve seen no evidence that any of that predates the Holocene.
I suppose it’s fitting that I was unable to log into this site to reply yesterday because of email difficulties…
I’m not a Luddite, but my purchasing decisions frequently boil down to “is it less than 10% of the original MSRP?” So no, I’m not an early adopter.
But…but…EVs will be *cheaper* to build than ICE in just a couple of years! Yeah, right. They will someday, but not in the couple of years I keep hearing from places in the InterTubes. And with the frosty weather coming to my part of the country, people with F-150s Lightnings stuck on the side of the road because they lost nearly half of their range but didn’t notice in time will be hearing “Get an ICE!”.
Don’t get me wrong, EV is definitely the future. I am just of a mind that that future is many more years down the road for most people than those pushing the EVs would like to think. For some use cases they’re great right now, but to replace ICE vehicles they still have a ways to go.
Cheaper to build does not mean they will be cheaper to buy. One unfortunate lesson the OEMs seem to have learned from the COVID shutdowns is that enough people will pay more than they once thought to enable them to achieve profits higher than expected.
I’ve been going to the Chicago Auto Show since 1982, I don’t think I’ve missed a year. Last year’s show was “off” without the north hall open, but nothing compared to the Covid-delayed August show of 2020. That was really kind of sad. But we went, keeping my run unbroken.
Looking forward to 2023 because we have to find a car my wife likes, her car needs replacement in the next year. Everyone says auto shows are dying but I challenge that notion; where else can you check out nearly the entire market without a salesman hounding you the entire time?
Put a reservation in for a lightning the day after it came out – finally received notice yesterday (of all days) that I could order. The Pro is sold out for 23MY, so you can’t even buy that – so you’re looking at $65K at the cheapest for a XLT.
No thanks. I didn’t want a full size truck anyway, and the value proposition of this thing has just cratered in the last year.
I cancelled my reservation as soon as I found out that they weren’t offering the extended battery on the Pro. I have the $100 refundable on a Silverado EV, and I plan to cancel that one if they pull the same crap.
And, yeah, I would definitely go for a mid-size or smaller, assuming they get enough range out of one.
Bundling the extended battery with another $10k option, effectively making it +$20k, was an absolutely ridiculous move by ford.
they offfered it, but only to fleet customers. at under 50K on the sticker that seemed like the truck to get for sure. obviously they were optimistic they could beat the initial costs with increased volume purchasing and that just did not work out.
That is true. I almost tried to get a few people in on a fleet order, but it was a lot of work to go through to buy a pickup. Oh, well, I will keep using my old Silverado for pickup things.
Faraday is more like Faraway future for when they’re going to release something…
Generally I am wait and see, try to avoid first year. I also research like mad so the test drive is confirmation then the dealing.
I find this cuts down the time in the dealership as they want to move units as well.
If the deal isn’t right, I walk away. They have to sell me a car, I don’t have to buy it.
“When it comes to buying new cars (or new anything) are you a fast-mover or a waiter? Were you the first person to get an iPhone or did you let the bugs get worked out first?”
I vary a bit. I have preordered phones, but generally not anything completely new (still not convinced foldable smartphones are worth the tradeoffs, for example). I had an order set up for a Maverick before they were available, but I backed out when . I had an order for the Sportage PHEV before it was released, but the tax credit situation and delivery timing stopped that one. I felt I was taking a bit of a risk with a new unproven model, but the order was in under the tax credit wire. I wasn’t willing to try to claim it on next year’s taxes, though, so delivery delays made me get my non-refundable deposit back.
Once they announce efficiency numbers for the upcoming Tacoma, I might order it. That one feels a little safer, because Toyotas are pretty consistent.
I usually prefer to let things get sorted out with me models. With that said, a few years ago, I purchased a 4runner that was the first year of the run. The only issue I had was that the body shop didn’t have parts listing to fix it when my caught got rear ended a few weeks after I got it. To be fair though, wasn’t much new design under the sheet metal.
I’ve been on both sides of the early vs late buying.
I was the first person in line for my G8 at the dealer.
More recently, I’ve discovered the virtues of saving money by waiting, which is what I’ve done with most of my other cars.
This may or may not be sustainable depending on how long the automakers want to keep up with their “scarcity” excuses. If the vehicles I want are still commanding sticker or higher years into the run, and there’s no leftovers rotting on dealer lots, might as well just buy early and enjoy for longer.
“It’s the drinkiest place I’ve ever been.”
Cheers, I’ll drink to that! Hand me the Malort.
“Tonight’s the night you fight your dad” – Malört
I always liked “These pants aren’t going to shit themselves” – Malört
“The official drink of ‘I’m not getting my security deposit back.'”
At this rate, by the time Ford allows consumers to go for the Pro with extended battery, it’s going to be nearly as expensive as the XLT with lux package that offered the extended battery at launch.
$67,743 for fleet customers. We’re already there.
Except that probably “never” is when they’ll let retail customers buy one. The best you can hope for is the base-trim XLT with the ER battery. They’ll be in the next generation before lower trim ER versions start to trickle out. And those might not have a frame. They might be airquotes-trucks.
That’s pretty close. If I recall, with the required the XLT Lux package, the extended battery version started about 75k. It’s up to about 81k now.
And you are probably right that they’ll probably never let the retail folks get a base model with the full range. They know it’s the easiest upsell they can make. If they come up with faster charging, that’ll probably be on a Lariat or something.