Ahoy there, Autopians! Today on Shitbox Showdown, we’re going to the opposite end of the car size scale, and looking at a couple of good old fashioned American barges. Big V8s, long bench seats, and marshmallows for springs are the order of the day. But first, let’s take a look at the final tally of our tiny Subies:
Yep. I say again: Tiny. Rally. Car. The 360 is best left as a museum piece at this point, or hacked up into something even weirder.
Either of yesterday’s choices could nearly fit into the trunks of today’s. These cars are the reason the little Subaru 360 felt so tiny and fragile on American roads. I bet the engine and transmission of either of these alone weigh about as much as that little Subaru. They’re inefficient, cumbersome, a pain in the ass to park, and lumber around corners like a moose on rollerblades, but for gobbling up miles of Interstate in smooth serenity, there’s nothing quite like them. Let’s dive in.
1971 Plymouth Fury Gran Coupe – $1,595
Engine/drivetrain: 360 cubic inch V8, 3 speed automatic, RWD
Location: outside St Helens, OR
Odometer reading: unknown
Runs/drives? not quite
“Plymouth Fury” might be one of the greatest car names of all time. It’s also, in most cases, a misnomer: the Fury is quite a nice, civilized car. (Well, except that one.) Plymouth’s full-sized sedan grew over the course of the 1960s into this 120-inch-wheelbase monster. And yes, all the info I found says that this particular model of the 1971 Fury was called the “Gran Coupe,” even when it had four doors. (And the Germans thought they were doing something new.)
The seller might be wrong about one thing, though: they claim this car has the “Mod Top” package, but it appears that option was only offered in 1969 and 1970, and never on the Fury. But this car’s paisley-print vinyl top and seats were from the factory, as part of the Gran Coupe package, as was the then-new 360 cubic inch V8.
The engine doesn’t run, but it sounds like it may be due to just sitting for a while. Old V8s like this aren’t complicated; if you’ve got fuel, spark, and compression, you should be able to get it started without much trouble. The rest of the car looks OK, give or take a little rust; mostly it’s just dirty. And that paisley interior is undeniably cool.
It’s not the cool slab-sided stacked-headlight ’66 that’s my personal favorite Plymouth Fury, but it’s still a nice car. Or it was once, and maybe could be again.
1969 Cadillac Sedan DeVille – $1,995
Engine/drivetrain: 472 cubic inch V8, 3 speed automatic, RWD
Location: Torrance, CA
Odometer reading: 40,000 miles
Runs/drives? Nope
Plymouth Fury not big enough for you? Well, feast your eyes on this beauty. Eighteen feet and nine inches of American steel, with big chrome bumpers stretching from sea to shining sea. Utterly unmistakable for anything but a Cadillac. Seven point seven liters under that massive hood, and barely a smog control device in sight. Meet the 1969 Cadillac Sedan DeVille.
This particular DeVille needs a little help. The seller says it has a rebuilt engine that needs to be hooked up, but they don’t have the ability to finish it. If that massive hunk of cast iron is already between the frame rails, connecting everything up and getting it running should be an easy task for an accomplished do-it-yourselfer.
This Caddy looks a little rough outside, with a bit of rust around the edges, but inside it’s quite nice. But with only 40,000 miles on the clock, it should be. And personally, I kinda like the scruffy look on the outside; it looks like something a second-rate private eye in an Elmore Leonard novel should be driving. It’s got character.
OK, sure, it probably gets eight miles to the gallon, which isn’t ideal these days. But where else are you going to find such a massive quantity of faded glory for so cheap?
It’s strange to think that these behemoths used to be normal-sized cars, because they were followed by twenty years of downsizing. But everything old is new again: A new Chevy Silverado crew cab is an inch and a half wider than this Cadillac, and sixteen inches longer. But I bet I know which one rides smoother.
So what’ll it be: a paisley Plymouth, or a hardtop Caddy?
Fury all the way. One of the very few 4-doors that I think look as good if not better than their two-door counterparts. Sleek with the hideaway headlamps, would take nicely to a set of Mopar Rallyes and white letter tires, and the 360 could be setup run like hell.
I vored for the Cady
And he’s tradin’ in his Chevy for a Cadillac..ac…ac.aaaccc….aaacc…. 😉
Caddy
I must be having a heat stroke!! 🙁
I voted for the Caddy!
Legitimately, I think the Mopar is the better deal, but I just have to vote for the Caddy. A gold with gold interior ’69 Sedan de Ville was my first Cadillac and I still have it. Well, I think I do – it’s in a barn near my hometown and I haven’t actually looked at the car in over 25 years. I heard the people who own the property are thinking of selling, so I really should look into getting it moved out of there soon.
I bought that Caddy for $300 in high school, got it running and driving, started in on the body, and learned quickly what a pain Midwest rust really is to deal with. Still, the few times I actually got to take it out and drive it around were amazing – a giant barge that turned with ease; it’s “Dardanelle” interior swallowing up myself and 5 friends with ease; the 472 that propelled everything forward with ease. “Ease” was what that car was all about.
Well, except for the aforementioned rust. It was all over, and I had it in my head that this was going to be a show car. So, clueless 17-year-old me started spending way to much time trying to shape and weld in new pieces of tin everywhere. That, along with carefully removing the various trim pieces and sanding the acres of sheet metal burned up quite a few hours of spare time. I wanted it to be black, so I started in with patching small rust holes in the door jambs and sanding every inch of those as well. I got quite a ways with it, and was really just fortunate enough to work for a guy that let me use his body shop afterhours. However, after six months of this Sisyphean ordeal, I found a much nicer ’68 Coupe de Ville that I ended up buying and the now chromeless, multi-colored-primer ’69 went into a friend’s barn.
If I bought this one, it would be a great excuse to drag my first one out of that barn and set to finally finishing that project, building a nice one out of the two. Plus, who doesn’t want the excuse to have “69 Nice” as they’re personalized license plate?
Two fantastic projects, both slightly after their best generation (’65-68, in each case, in my opinion) but still handsome.
I only went for the Plymouth ’cause my Bubbe would’ve preferred to ride in it versus being seen in a Cadillac. No wrong choice today.
40k miles on the Caddy? I’m calling BS on that. Probably 140k (I doubt a car of that vintage would make it to 240k).
“I got me a Chrysler, it’s as big as a whale, and it’s about to set sail!”
Both are real nice car, but i have to go with the Caddy on this one. Its simply to nice looking.
When I first clicked on the article I thought “Caddy no brainer!” but the Fury is dirty but straight, while the Caddy is rusty in scary places that doesn’t make me confident about its roadworthiness. Plus, that interior doesn’t look right at all… maybe some ill-advised re-skin of the seats? In any event, it is missing the charm I expect of a luxo-barge of that type.
Fury all the way, love the paisley interior. Plus if that old 360 is past saving, the junkyards are brimming with Magnum 5.9 ram trucks just waiting to be heart donors. Or, if you’re in for a more ambitious project, a 5.7 Hemi would be a real treat in that thing, too…
As much as I love Caddies, the Fury is the clear choice here. The Caddy has been screwed with by idiots who couldn’t finish the job. It also has rust holes through the outside of the body and broken taillights that will not be easy or cheap to replace.
Plus, fuselage Mopars are dead sexy!
Mopar. Those Caddy motors sound awesome and awesomely expensive at the same time. Having a powertrain with parts still available everywhere sounds good.
Caddy! Although all the comments are pro-Mopar.
I really think the DeVille should be d-EV-illed!!
Just my worthless opinion 🙂
My best buddy had a ’78 Sedan de Ville. Great smooth drive, only finding a parking space for an almost 6 meter long car here in the Netherlands is a nightmare. And so were/are the gas prices here, so he was using LPG.
Two reasons why I voted Justy and secretely wanting that 360.
Neither as I don’t care to try to keep a carbureted engine going on today’s “fuel”.
I run a 67 CJ5 and a 78 MGB on modern fuel. Both are carbureted. There’s no real issue. I am not sure if the Jeep has had hardened valve seats installed over its life but it’s been working fine for several years.
It’s a challenge. And a shame.
I’d take the Plymouth for sentimental value; Dad had a ’76 Plymouth Gran Fury station wagon. That 302 was a beast, he used to drag guys off the lights with it. Then one day the power steering failed and the repair costs were more than the trade-in value of the car, and it went for scrap.
302? It would have been a 318/360 LA series, a 383/400 B series or 440 RB series engine.
The Caddy is probably worth more than $2k for the engine alone, not to mention the interior fittings and seats. For a car to restore and drive though the Fury is a better choice. Having a lien in lieu of a title sounds scary, but there are plenty of states that will issue a title on a 51 year old car without too much hassle.
I like the look of the Fury, especially the front end and paisley print. But if I’m going Land Yacht, I’m going with the King of the Land Yacht. This is something that I might cruise to get groceries in and put the whole damn store in the trunk. It’s something that you putter around in and not take it on the highway. It’s a car you show off. Cadillac may be considered an old folks car today, but classic Caddies still have some stroke.
Sorry, the king of the Land Yacht isn’t this one. This is a DeVille, Cadillac’s “small” car.
Oh yes, a car with a curb weight of over 4,700lbs and a length of 18.75ft is the small one. The true king of the land yachts is the Cadillac Fleetwood 75 non-limousine. Which in 1973, was roughly 21 feet long.
I remember that my uncle’s Fleetwood was longer than our Caprice Estate wagon by a good margin. Those things are HUGE. I think my MGB would fit in its trunk.
The Caddy is way better looking to me. Since they are both non-runners I would choose the Caddy as my “project from hell” to get running.
As someone who has handled a Cadillac gigantic block? Plymouth Fury all day every day.
Look, it’s bad enough the 472 has atrociously bad emissions gear that chokes it to death. You can delete the air pump, use modern cats, tune the carb, pass smog with ease, and have 400ft/lbs of torque on tap. But that won’t change that parts are hard to come by and it’s A LITERAL HALF TON OF WEIGHT.
Oh yes, Virginia. Your engine hoist bent just LOOKING at that fucker. Because it’s 100% cast iron and with walls thick enough to support the 500ci casting. Fully dressed, I am absolutely NOT joking about it pushing a thousand pounds. These behemoths pushed 5000lbs curb as drop-tops.
As for the assertion the Mod Top isn’t, because it’s a ’71? Nope; that’s a legit Mod Top. There’s two versions of the Mod Top that I’m familiar with – 1970 floral, and 1971 paisley. This is the correct paisley. And the fact that the interior is not only intact but appears to be in excellent condition is a huge deal. Replacing that upholstery is insanely expensive, because Mopar Tax. (It’s very fucking real.)
If the landau’s got no holes, that alone will save you $8k on a frame-off job. Any holes in the landau, you’ve almost certainly got fatal roof rot, and these are unibody. The standard landeau’s easily $1k in parts, forget a Mod Top. And the roof is a NASTY job – full frame jig even if you’re just sectioning sheet. But it’s still a B-body with an LA and a TorqueFlite. If you can’t find a part, it’s because you didn’t look.
Tell me more about this…the Fury is unibody? Or is that a designation for the roof structure?
Yeah, I got lost at the intersection of “frame-off job” and “unibody”.
It’s unibody. Chrysler made the switch around 1960 or so.
I kinda hate to be the “WELL AXCHUALLY” guy, but the Caddy 472/500 motors are amazingly light, considering how heavy the cars were and how large their displacements were. I think ’68 was the first year for the 472, it replaced the old postwar 331/365/390 Cad V-8’s and used modern(for the time) casting and design techniques. I’m speaking from memory here, but a fully-dressed 472/500 is ~110lbs lighter than a big-block Chevy(most of it is in the heads) and going with headers and an aluminum intake on the Caddy motor brings its poundage down to about 600lbs, within spitting distance of an iron SBC.
Back around Y2K I built a 472 for my shop beater ’82 GMC 3/4-ton pickup and it was a ton lighter than the 6.2 Detroit diesel that came with the truck. I had to cut a whole coil out of the front springs to bring the front end down to stock height, and those 6.2’s were pretty light for a diesel. It was a fun parts runner, used to shock people at the stoplight drags.
Long time Caddy fan, once a Caddy owner, but today I vote paisley.
If they were both in better shape, the Caddy for sure. But Caddies don’t come back to life all that easily.
Mopars, on the other hand, were almost designed to be neglected. I’ll take the Fury.
Ugh. Even without that rust, the Cadillac is a harbinger of everything that was wrong with American auto design in the early 1970s. What a pig. Inside and out.
The Fury is brown on the inside, and there should be plenty of room for a Hellephant swap 😉
Full disclosure: I am a Mopar guy (some of you commenters may have seen my stuff enough to know).
I understand the DeVille is iconic and if you’re buying engine by cubic inches per dollar, that’s the way to go. But man, I love the Fury. The lines, the interior, the tri-spoke tiller, that 360 V8. It speaks of an owner who says, “I’m responsible, but I like to have fun when I’m alone.” Every time I go to a car show, which admittedly isn’t too often, I’m usually drooling over the Fury and Gran Fury examples.
Am not a Mopar guy, yet agree the Fury is by far the better option;
In fact, this one is on my craigslist ‘favorites’ / saved list.
Might be buying it, but have too many projects already.
In college, a good buddy owned a trashed Fury that had so much floor rust that you could see the road until he fitted pieces of plywood into the floor wells. But it drove like a tank and could haul approximately 427 people at once. With cheap gas at the time, it didn’t matter that you could see the fuel gauge dropping as we drove. It was awesome, and ended its life as a demolition derby champion. For that reason only, give me the Fury.
Plymouth all the way for me. Not only am I more attracted to Plymouths than Caddys, the Cadillac sounds too sketchy for me.
If he lacks the skills (or the ability to find someone with them) to install the engine, how great did the rebuild go? I’m very skeptical of situations like that.
“Oh I spent huge money/time on a complicated process, just to give it away for cheap non-running because of some minor stuff left to do.”
Eh, I read it as “had a good friend who is the mechanic, he’s dead now and I’m done with this project”.
I’m glad he’s got it like that, to dump a bunch of money into it and walk away unscathed. Whew.
Normally I’d go for the Caddy, but the rust monster has been using this one as a midnight snack, plus the Fury has hidden headlights, so in the case Mopar or No Car.