Everything has gotten expensive and heavy and complicated, so it’s almost a miracle that Toyota produces something that’s none of the above. The Toyota GR86 feels like a car that Toyota stopped building two decades ago and if you’re in the market for a new sports car it’s hard to make an argument against it. This is the car the Internet says it wants and the only thing that’s changed is it’s better in almost every way.
[Full Disclosure: Toyota gave me the car and a tank of gas for a week. It was a pretty good week.]
The Basics
Price: Starts at $28,995 (Tested the Premium trim at $33,095 with destination)
Engine: 2.4-liter boxer four, 228 hp, 184 lb-ft
Transmission: 6-speed manual, 6-speed auto available, RWD
Fuel Economy: 20 city/27 highway/22 combined
Body Style: Two-door coupe
Why Does It Exist?
A fair question. Toyota spent much of the early part of the 2000s offering cars that were as beige on the inside as they were on the outside. For a long-ish period of time the fastest Toyota you could buy was the RAV4 with the V6. That’s embarrassing for a company that brought the world 2000GT, Supra, Celica, and Hachiroku AE86.
In 2013, the company showed the world it could do better with the production of a car they called the Scion FR-S (and Subaru called the BRZ). Scion is gone, so we currently get the car as the GR86. This is the second generation of the platform.
The bigger why, though, is that Toyota’s CEO Akio Toyoda told people they’d stop building boring cars. Big talk for a company that makes the Prius. And then you look at the 2023 Toyota Prius and realize he wasn’t just jawboning.
What Makes It Tick
Did I mention Subaru? This is important. Subaru is responsible for the motor in the BRZ/GR86 twins and, because it’s Subaru, it comes with a 2.4-liter, four-cylinder boxer engine. I have a Forester, and the persistence of the boxer engine in cars like the Ascent feels almost like a bit that’s gone on too long, but EVs are coming so why even bother changing it. The biggest benefit, of course, is the motor is flatter (the pistons go side-to-side in an H pattern as opposed to the traditional up-down of an inline-four). A flatter motor means a lower center of gravity and that’s good for sports cars. This is a sports car.
I’ve had the chance to drive a couple of the first-gen cars and neither of them felt underpowered and, at the same time, no one will complain about them adding more juice. I’m pro-naturally aspirated motors, especially now that they’re so rare, and I credit Toyota for not slapping on a turbo and instead making the motor bigger (growing from 2.0 liters to 2.4 liters). Horsepower is up 11% to 228 hp and torque climbs even more, increasing to 184 lb-ft compared to the old motor’s 156 lb-ft. There’s no replacement for displacement, et cetera.
On the suspension side, all the cars get the fairly traditional MacPherson strut setup in front and a multilink rear with “GR circuit-tuned” coil springs and shock absorbers. Toyota and Subaru like to make a big deal about how these cars are different and the suspension piece is where this is most obvious.
The Toyota uses iron steering knuckles (the piece that connects the steering tie rods/suspension arms to the hubs/bearings that carry the wheels) and the Subaru uses a seemingly nicer aluminum knuckle. Additionally, the Toyota has a traditional rear stabilizer bar and the Subaru BRZ has a more advanced design.
Check out this video with Best Motoring legend Keiichi Tscuhiya and you’ll see the BRZ’s chief engineer point this out with a body-less car that’s half-Toyota/half-Subaru:
I’m not suspension engineer, but I know one, so I asked Huibert Mees what he thinks about this setup:
I see what’s going on. Toyota mounts the stabar (stabilizer bar/sway bar) to the subframe which means the forces from the stabar need to go through the subframe rubber mounts in order to get to the body. In the Subaru, the brackets holding the stabar are attached directly to the body through the subframe bolts. This means the forces from the stabar go directly into the body without deflecting (and being filtered by) the rubber subframe bushings.
A more direct acting read stabar will help tighten up the steering. By the way, the rear suspension has more impact on steering feel than the front. Believe it or not. That’s why I always liked rear suspension design more than front. The rear is far more influential on how a car behaves and feels than the front. That’s why you will often see simple MacPherson struts on cars but then a very complex rear. Porsche 911’s are good examples of that.
It would be fun to drive these two cars back-to-back to see how obvious that is, but it’s impossible for me to extrapolate the differences otherwise (and it’s possible I couldn’t if I had both of them).
Tsuchiya goes on to wail on the cars a bit and says the Toyota has “soft muscularity” per the translation and, yeah, maybe stop reading here because I can’t top that. Also, just for funsies, here’s Tsuchiya giving the full Best Motoring in an AE86, this car’s predecessor:
What a legend.
How does it look?
A kid who goes to school with my daughter walked up to the car and immediately went: “Wow, you have a Ferrari!?!” I’m not sure if the surprise was more that he was seeing a Ferrari or that I, the dorky dad who plays card games with his parents, would somehow have been granted access to a Ferrari.
It’s not a Ferrari. It’s a Toyota. He should know, his parents have two Toyotas. To be fair to the kid, it’s more like a Ferrari than it is like any Toyota he has ever seen in his short existence. Multiple people who saw it were surprised it was not an Italian car and seemingly impressed.
My impressions are a little more complicated. I’m a fan of the simpler first gen FR-S/BRZ. Credit to the designer who can make a car look athletic and fast without sculpting it with a dozen character lines that go nowhere (ahem, Supra). Was it too simple? Maybe. The new GR86 is not simple. There are curves here where there were once creases, even if the whole body is roughly proportional to what came before it.
The GR86’s most impressive angle is rear three-quarter, no question. The trunkline creates a lovely focal point that draws the eyes and highlights the much improved taillights and duckbill spoiler. On the side, too, are wider fenders that slope gently into a curved rocker panel that’s picked up with a vent to exhaust the brakes. The front is maybe a touch fussy, but the headlights do gain more character and the whole affair is a major improvement.
How’s the interior?
I
nside, the car is even better. There’s no reason why an affordable sports car needs an extremely fancy interior and, yet, the outgoing FRS was cheap-to-a-fault. Every part of the old car felt like an afterthought. Clearly, Toyota/Subaru took the feedback and made an interior that’s centered on the driver and still a nice place to toss a few quarters into the pond of existence.
There’s even a backseat, though it’s more like the apple slices-instead-of-fries option at McDonald’s in that it’s primarily intended for children and even then largely theoretical. With no front seat passenger my daughter could sit rather comfortably in her booster seat and was amazed that she got her own window.
Can one love a gauge cluster? I love the GR86’s gauge cluster. Mimicking the Boxer engine, I assume, you’ve got what appears to the driver as a round screen in the middle and two smaller, rectangular screens on the side. In normal driving mode you get a big tach in the middle and your choice of data on the sides. I adore the little interactive dyno graph on the side that shows horsepower and torque depending on your RPM. In track mode you get a more racing-oriented linear tach in the middle that lights up with bar graphs as you rev higher.
The difference between a gimmick and a feature is purely a measure of emotional effectiveness and not any actual utility. A lot of cars, now, will shine the brand’s logo on the ground when you open the door. The whole world can see you drive a Kia at night! I find this gimmicky and all it does is make me slightly embarrassed. But that’s me. If you’ve worked hard all your life and your Telluride is a measure of that success then the little ground light is as important a feature as the motor or the roof or any of the rest of the car.
All the little details of the gauge cluster are not a gimmick to me. They’re a key feature to me. Even the font choice in the GR86 is important. Everything looks just a little early-LCD. A little TI-86. It’s perfect.
What’s It Like To Drive?
There’s no way my wife has read this far so I’ll tell you a little secret: I put the carseat in the back of the GR86 to take my daughter to school (that’s not the secret part). My parking spot is behind a building and there’s a narrow drive that connects it to a wide avenue with good sight lines. The first day we left for school I thought I’d delight my daughter by revving the motor a bit as I turned onto the avenue and, oops, I may have tapped on the gas a little more than I initially intended and sent the car gently sideways. Stability control kicked in and so it did that little ESC shimmy you’re used to if you drive like an idiot often enough. My daughter giggled.
What am I supposed to do the next day? Similar program, but this time there’s a bit of moisture on the ground and Track Mode may have been engaged (with the manual transmission you can dial down stability control by pressing the button). My daughter hollered with joy.
I say this not to intimate that I drive like a moron. With a kid in the car I’m extra cautious. It’s just that the GR86 is so predictable to drive and so nicely balanced that I knew I was not in danger of causing any harm to other people, myself, or my little one by engaging in a little playful inertia.
For the week I had the car I kept trying to find a twistier, more undulating road to unsettle it. To unsettle myself. I never found it. The six-speed shifts with a pleasurable action and, though I know intellectually that it redlines at 7,400 RPM, emotionally it felt more like 10,000 RPM. Did it sound great at high revs? Not really. Did I care? Also not really.
Toyota claims a 0-60 MPH time of 6.1 seconds and that number seems easily achievable without much effort. All models get a mechanical limited-slip differential, but the base model still gets the 17-inch Michelin Primacy HP summer times. This being the Premium trim, my GR86 came equipped with 18-inch wheels and Michelin Pilot Sport 4 summers (215/40R18 if you’re curious). These are the tires to have, pretty much always.
If there’s one qualm about the driving experience is that, while I’m not an expert heel-and-toer, the pedals slightly misaligned. My size 11 Onitsuka Tigers aren’t super broad but the throttle pedal seems a little off and a little too narrow. Perhaps with different feet it isn’t an issue?
A slightly wonky noise and imperfect pedals do not ruin the driving experience. Far from it. The new Supra is not particularly memorable to drive and I got to mash it around an autocross course and even feebly drifted it. The GR86 is extremely memorable and much cheaper.
The Verdict
What else do you people need out of life? If you want a Miata, get a Miata. If you have a kid and maybe want to transport actual items get a GR86. Even if you didn’t have a kid maybe you should get the GR86. I’m trained, as an autojournalist, to love the Miata. And I do. We are fortunate to live in a universe and a dimension where both cars exist simultaneously. It doesn’t take a lot of indoctrination to also love the Toyota.
I say this a lot and the repetition is intentional: It’s a great time to love cars. Sure, you gotta wait for stuff, but instant gratification turns you into a miserable twerp over time. Right now, for about $33,000 (in theory), you can walk into a Toyota dealer, right past the Camry and drive out with a RWD sports car with an honest-to-Gozer manual transmission. A good sports car. A sports car that looks and feels right. Maybe a great sports car. And if that’s not your thing you can get an AWD turbo rally hatchback.
Live life kids. It doesn’t get better. Maybe it does. But you don’t know that for sure. Here’s a list of things that happened between my 18th and 25th year on this plant: Enron, 9/11, 2nd Gulf War, Norbit, The Columbia Disaster, Hurricane Katrina, and the Great Recession. Tomorrow’s not promised to any of us so drive the cars while the cars are good, dammit.
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Photos: Author, Joel Johnson, Toyota
Hey folks! Crazy long-term owner of a ’13 BRZ Limited with 90K.
I’ve lived with this car for 10 years now and I’ve enjoyed every minute of it. After owning an early R53 Mini, the “torque dip” on the BRZ is trivial in comparison. I’ve corrected a couple of design problems (thank you Hyundai for selling a steering motor coupling by itself) and I’ve installed a cat-back exhaust and I have a solid, great sounding sports car I can occasionally carry stuff in. Yes, it would be nice if it had a hatchback, but I do understand the choice to keep the structure stiff. More power would be fun, but I can turn the driver aids off anytime and drift and do donuts all day.
We had an unexpected flat on the van once as we started on a 200 mile trip, had to stuff 4 adults in my car for the trip, and we survived. I alternated with my wife taking the kids to school and picking them up till they were in their teens and we survived. I’ve put 4 new tires in the back to have them installed and I survived.
I’m now considering buying an older, restored “retirement” car and I can’t keep from considering keeping the BRZ and putting some money into tasteful mods instead.
Buy one and drive it long enough to really get to know it and you’ll feel sorry for all the other people on the road.
I can’t believe you’d do that with your daughter in the car! You’ve cursed her to a lifelong obsession with cars. You’ve basically hooked her on a really, really expensive drug.
How could you!
If this car lost about 2 feet to its width, 1 foot to its height, and at least 500 lbs, I’d like it. As it is, it’s too big and heavy. Granted, compared to almost everything else on the market today at any price point, it is preferable.
I love that these exist. I would really like something this this for a daily driver, but my wife refuses to learn to drive a stick. I drove a Saturn Astra manual for about 9 years and she did 2 lessons and gave up. We have had the MGB for over 2 years and I’m willing to teach her any time, but she hasn’t shown any interest. It’s just too much of a pain to have a primary car that she can’t drive if there’s an issue with her car.
One thing I’m always a bit shocked about with these is that they are only rated at 27 mpg on the highway and 22 combined. It just seems like something this size should easily get into the low 30’s at highway speeds, especially on premium fuel. Our 7 passenger, 310hp crossover is rated at only 1 mpg less than this on the highway and 1 less combined fuel economy.
I average just over 30 in mixed driving even with the short 6th gear (same speed/rpm as 5th in my ‘83 Subaru with 1/3 the power), higher than the limit cruising speeds, and daily pulls to redline. Hit 33 once, but that was almost all highway at just 70-75. Worst was just under 27 with mostly Boston city traffic. Drive it like a normal car and it’ll get reasonable mileage. People don’t and blame the car when they’re the idiot racing to and from every light, not adjusting to the traffic around them, and not keeping engine load to a minimum when they’re just cruising around. I always think of when Lindbergh found his balls again and taught the Pacific fighter pilots how to maximize range, which resulted in big improvements, especially in that theater where saving some fuel could mean making it back or ditching in a vast uncaring ocean of relentless sun, enemy ships, and sharks. Some people only seem to understand power at WOT and have trouble with the effects of engine load on consumption.
That’s good to hear and is more like what I would have expected the rating to be.
One thing I really love about this car is that it’s such potent ammunition to use against the assholes that always pipe up about how “they don’t make manuals any more because all you losers that say you want one will never buy one new.” The first 6 months this thing was on sale were a complete nightmare for anyone who wanted a manual, which I can say was more than 80% of people actively seeking a GR86. This is based on the google docs survey data on GR86 dot org. MEANWHILE. What was Toyota building? A shit ton of automatics. Literally the inverse of the demand. Later in summer more manual cars started to come, so it might have been partly supply chain related. But the blend never quite got to 50/50, always more autos allocated. And don’t get me started on base vs. premium trim. Exact same story. What do we want? Premium! What does Toyota build? Base!
Anyhow if someone says that I just say “tell that to the poor guys trying to get a manual GR86.” It’s not that we won’t buy a new manual sports car, its just that it has to be worth the money.
While I’d rather have a GR Corolla, I like these too and agree the updated design is more “mature” looking. Of course I saw a yellow Supra today and thought it looked good too.
Traffic is better these days when I do commute in, so having a manual daily might not suck as much as the pre-COVID gridlock days. Yes, I think the idea of dealing with a clutch for what could often be 30 minutes of stop and go traffic every day coming home sounded terrible.
I do have to deal with some winter weather, which I suspect could be adequately solved with winter tires because this car isn’t super overpowered. I do wish a 4 cylinder in 2022-23 would do better than 20/27 for when gas goes back over $4. Might as well get a Corvette for that kind of mileage. Or the automatic, but half the point of getting this would be to say I owned a manual transmission, gasoline powered sports car before they are extinct.
A little slide gets a giggle and bigger slide gets a laugh. You, Sir, are a good father.
If you think this is good for middle-class dads, it’s even better for middle-class childfree people. If you didn’t have a kid, you would probably own a GR86, instead of just borrowing one for a week. Having children is the fastest way to kill your dreams.
Only Toyota would get away with a car name pronounced “Great Sex”
So there’s that.
I own a 2019 BRZ, the last of the first generation car. I’ve owned well over 100 cars in my life, and IMHO, this is simply one of the most joyful.
It’s exactly what a ‘sports car’ should be. It reminds me very much of sports cars from the 1960’s and 1970’s I used to own back in the day (yeah, I’m that old). It’s a modern-day incarnation of an Opel GT, MGB-GT, or Fiat 124. Cars whose primary purpose was to make sure the driver had fun driving them (but the BRZ is so much more reliable, safer, comfortable, and livable as a daily driver than anything from the 60’s/70’s).
The hell with the ‘numbers’ so many people obsess over, arguing over tenths of a second differences in 0-60 or 1/4 mile times. Realistically, how many people rip off timed 0-60 runs at every stoplight, or try to set Nurburgring track records on weekends? The BRZ is simply pure, undiluted fun to drive. Fun to drive in the old-school analog way, the way it feels to the seat of my pants and not some arbitrary ‘numbers’ that don’t mean a thing in street driving.
Though my car is a mere first generation model with ‘only’ 205 hp, it’s enough for me. It’s more than enough to be fun, to feel the acceleration on the street without the need to be an adolescent and challenge muscle cars to drag races that will only end up with a night in jail (or an accident). Driving it ‘playfully’ (but not pedal to the metal, there’s no need for that), I don’t feel (or maybe just don’t care about) the ‘torque dip’ so many complain about but probably don’t actually experience. The immediacy and linear response of a naturally aspirated engine is sweet compared to the rubber-band catapult of most turbos.
If you’ve never driven one, before joining the ranks of internet armchair experts take one for a ride on secondary roads, and just row through the gears while taking some twisties. It’ll remind you of what cars are supposed to be all about (at least to me): fun.
From all the reviews, the second-generation car certainly sounds ‘superior’ in terms of power and other things. Someday, when the pandemic insanity of supply chain disruptions calms down and it becomes possible to actually test drive a car before buying it (and then able to buy it without a horror-movie dealer ADM), I’d like to buy one. But I’m in no hurry. With all the fun it is to just drive this car, I really don’t need any more.
Get out and drive. Have fun. Before we know it, internal combustion cars will be in the minority, gas will cost more than good Scotch, and most ‘automobiles’ on the road will be soulless, anodyne, boring, battery-powered autonomous electric transportation pods. Appliances, with all the soul and character of a dishwasher. We’ll look back and miss the days when it was possible to buy gas for only $4.99 a gallon, and drive a car with an actual stick shift and clutch. I’m taking mine out tomorrow, it’s supposed to be a dry winter day here in New England, just for the hell of it, with no particular destination in mind.
If not now, when?
The idea of replacing my 2013 with a 2023 sounds pretty appealing. A little more power, a little more comfort (sounds like the suspension updates on the facelifted cars like yours take away a lot of the harshness), some more features. And at face value, a 10 year newer car with 0 miles and a warranty. But the car has been so perfectly reliable (a front wheel bearing is the only part that wasn’t in the service interval, and that’s arguable a wear-item), that it’s hard to justify replacing a car that seemingly will run forever.
That’s why I bought mine—who knows how long we have, be it the availability of this type of car or our own lives? It’s my daily. People ask why I don’t have a winter/traffic beater and the answer is that life is too short. I want to enjoy the time I can as best I can—yes, even traffic (to the extent that it can be), yes, with a manual. I even look forward to going to work now.
> For a long-ish period of time the fastest Toyota you could buy was the RAV4 with the V6
Ok, so thanks to BMW that isn’t the case anymore. But the fact that the 86 is still slower than the fastest RAV4 is still disappointing (comparing C&D’s 0-60 and quarter mile times for the 86 vs the RAV4 Prime).
Sports cars have never been about straight-line speed. Take a RAV4 through some winding roads or on a track, and tell me you wouldn’t rather have a GR86. The GR86 is still quicker than an S2000, so it’s no slouch.
Spec racing series (pro) for these GR86s in 2023. SRO is the sanctioning body.
Counterpoint – May I suggest a 2013-2018 Boxster S? Similar price, better everything (except a back seat).
Not better maintenance. No back seat for the kid. If you park it in a bad part of town they slash the soft top.
I cross-shopped GT86s against Cayman, and I preferred the steering on the 86, and that it feels fun at low speed.
The low running costs and the extra room inside for stuff was a bonus. My other car is a BMW Z4 Coupe, and that might well get replaced by a Cayman.
I liked it so much I bought one! Anyone have any long-term owner questions? (Base/Manual)
Yes! How is it for long drives? Is it extraordinarily noisy? And what kind of MPGs are you seeing? Thanks!
I got 22k on mine. I average just over 30mpg on summer blend, I’m getting about 29 on winter, though I went up 2 sizes on the snow tire sidewalls, so the gearing has changed about 7%. Cruising at low highway speed for most of a tank, I averaged 33 once, but I can’t drive that slow regularly and I’m a firm believer in frequent Italian tuneups. Worst I got with a bunch of city driving and higher highway speeds was in the 27 range on summer blend. I tend to do better with mileage than most because I hold the bare minimum throttle when there’s nowhere to go and I don’t ride people’s asses or race from every stop (just some of them) while I think other people are sloppy with the throttle and don’t adjust their driving to traffic conditions then complain about fuel use or say I must drive like an old person.
Noise-wise, it’s a sports car and I have a decent tolerance for it, but I was surprised it wasn’t a lot louder. It’s no Lexus, of course, but it’s quieter than my 1990 Legacy wagon was and I can have a conversation on the highway without raising my voice. It even rides pretty well over potholed roads. Again, it’s a sports car, so it’s stiff, but it isn’t punishing at all. One ex hated the ride of my Focus ST, but loves the GR. As a note, I have the base model with the 17s, so I can’t speak for the ride with the 18s.
I have the premium trim, finally got it in September. It sees daily duty in the fair weather months. I want to use it to keep miles down on our other cars but the long term idea is for it to be our “boomer” car. Cruises, weekend trips etc. I was a little worried it about how it would be on road trips though, whether long stints would wear us down. We’re still a few years away from 40 but man sometimes I feel like 60. Anyhow the wife and I went for a long weekend vacation kind of thing in it, probably 10-12 hours of driving over 3 days. No issues whatsoever. Its cozy, definitely firm but not punishing at all. We can easily go for multi-hour stints without feeling beat up.
Have you considered adding unequal-length headers or an aftermarket exhaust? They sound amazing and give quite a decent torque boost.
41 year old suburban dad here – man, I’ve been a little bit obsessed over these (and it’s Subie cousin) for a bit now. Maybe in a few years (kids are f’n expensive!)
Condoms and vasectomies are cheap. Best investment you’ll ever make.
Wow, you really hate kids don’t you? But apparently you really love the unequal length headers and an aftermarket exhaust.
I agree that the second generation’s styling falls a little flat, as the author said,whole most of today’s offerings are way too busy, the Toyobura is a little too plain.
However, as noted can be made to work as a practical daily driver, but you know what would make it look better?, a hatch. Having owned at least five two seater hard top fastback sports cars, including two as daily drivers, I can’t imagine living with one that doesn’t have a rear hatch. Loads of groceries, case of beer, pizza(!), sports gear, all so much easier to get in and out with a hatch. If you don’t haul more than two it makes your little coupe as practical or maybe even more practical than a sedan.
As one of the lowest price sports cars out there it is presumably aimed at and designed to be a daily driver, not just a weekend toy. The 2% or whatever lost in structural rigidity wouldn’t be missed, by me at least.
Yes YES! Ditto for ALL the dumb short-trunk cars. Make the Mustang a hatchback! Make the Accord a hatchback! We had a first-gen Volvo S60 with a great trunk, but a stupidly small opening. VAG does this for the A5, A7, and the Arteon, and they just work. Ditto the Volt (R.I.P.).
It should be a liftback for sure. I can fit a surprising amount of stuff in it, but the problem is getting it in and out. I most often have to go through the passenger door.
“while most of today’s offerings”
You know what would make it work better”
I pine for you edit button.
It’s time to celebrate cars like this Toyota, the Subaru version as well as the Mazda Miata, while we still have them. The last of the affordable sports car, brought to you by the Japanese. God bless them! And fwiw, I detect a bit of Toyota 2000GT in that rear side window. Forget Ferrari; think of this as the Everyman’s 2000GT.
I’m going to disagree with Matt here (man this is gonna get me fired) but I think this is much more grown up design wise than the previous gen. I always thought the original was trying to too hard to look JDM yo! All flicks and creases and general oriental busyness which they probably thought was what the target market wanted but I’ve always suspected kept more mainstream buyers away.
For enthusiast cars to succeed they need to appeal to the less hardcore as well. Someone who just wants a coupe or a roadster not necessarily for switchblade responses but simply because they want that kind of car. I feel this car has a more mature and grown up look that will help it sell more widely, because then there’s more chance we’ll get another.
Fair.
I agree. I had no interest in the previous design (or engine). The other one looked like a generic sports car to me (though not as bad as a Pontiac Solstice, which I think everyone who imagined cars scribbled something similar to in notebook margins in high school). The original was more reborn 240SX and this is more reborn 240Z than the current Nissan offering.
For me, this is a replacement for the formerly underappreciated vintage 2nd-tier exotics I always wanted, but have gotten way too expensive. Doesn’t quite look as good, sure as hell doesn’t sound as nice, but it’s faster, handles much better, I can drive it everyday, I don’t need to be best friends with a specialist and speak Italian to find obscure parts, and it has modern safety. Most importantly to me is it has a decent approximation of the feel.
“underappreciated vintage 2nd-tier exotics I always wanted, but have gotten way too expensive.”
That is a clever bit of wording that is pretty much story of my automotive life.
The three I almost bought, but a house took precedence were Alfa Montreal, Lamborghini Espada (also, the frequent maintenance), and a Euro bumper Maserati Khamsin (obviously a huge Gandini fan even if he found the production Montreal to be disappointing). Even great examples were little to no more than I paid for the GR for quite a long while. Not so much anymore. What are your top ones?
Sounds pretty amazing with unequal-length headers and an aftermarket exhaust…
A “Ferrari” for middle class dads? Granted it’s pretty good looking, probably handles well enough. But,
With that underpowered, thrashy Subie motor, it’s missing a lot of Ferrari-ness. It is a nice Toyo-baru, sports car. But, to even approach Ferrari, it needs a lot more power, AND the Ferrari sound.
It’s the SOUND, though. That agricultural, buzzy little boxer 4 just needs to sound way better.
It doesn’t stir the blood. There’s nothing like Ferrari’s aural sex.
I assume the little kid was assuming Italian Looking = Ferrari
Form the back I could maybe see an Alpha
Weeps silently in the corner mopping up sniffles with black turtleneck.
Kids see a sports car in red paint and they think Ferrari.
My 86 is grey, I’ve been asked if it’s an Aston Martin.
“That agricultural, buzzy little boxer 4 just needs to sound way better. It doesn’t stir the blood. There’s nothing like Ferrari’s aural sex”
Eh, that’s nothing a $50 fart can from a sketchy EBay seller can’t fix…
Megan Racing unequal-length headers and an Invidia exhaust. That combo sounds incredible.
Or K24 swap… Looks like you can buy whole kits for that.
Yeah, that’s an odd comparison, but it was a little kid saying it. It’s much closer to Porsche in looks and feel (the latter according to a number of Porsche owners who bought these as cheaper cars to track).
I have a previous generation BRZ. The other day I pulled into a parking space at a small local bakery. There was a crowd of kids eating outside there, maybe around 12 years old. After a few minutes, I was approached by one of them (they seemed to have had some sort of conclave, animatedly debating who was going to be brave enough to walk up to the old guy who just got out of the shiny red car).
He very politely asked me if the car was a Ferrari or a Maserati? He and his friends were talking about it and wanted to know, they had never seen one like it before. When I told him it was a Subaru, he struggled to repeat the name, ‘Soo-bah-roo?’, as if he’d never heard it before.
He then asked me what I did for a living, to be able to afford a car like that? (I told him to study science and math, go for STEM, and he could have one too).
It’s not underpowered. Despite Toyota’s claims, it actually makes closer to 250hp, and is faster than the Honda S2000, which is undeniably a serious sports car. The GR86 is very capable. Also, it can sound amazing with a set of unequal-length headers and an aftermarket exhaust. Like a WRX STI, only more pure and rev-happy. Look up a video of a GR86 with Megan Racing UEL headers and an Invidia exhaust, and you’ll see what I mean. If you still want more power, HKS makes a supercharger kit that will boost power to ~350hp, while keeping the instant response and linear power band.
Having worked in schools with the “littles”, it’s 99% likely the kid saw a swoopy red car-thing and the only brand he knew that looked like that was a Ferrari. I actually just test drove a GR86 last weekend but the dealership wanted $40000 for a used one. Yes it’s nowhere near a Ferrari, and sounds barely okay, but if it allows an average Joe a moment of driving bliss, that IS like a Ferrari. (I’ve been to Lime Rock so yes, I know Ferraris sound amazing. )
it is more of a supra alternative than a ferrari, but I am glad they retained it from the Scion days. Obviously the reason it still exists is because it sells well enough and makes adequate profit.
I have a weird relationship with this car because whenever something receives absolutely universal praise across the board I get a bit jaded. It’s almost set up to disappoint after a while. I have yet to drive the current or older one but this one has been fawned over so unanimously at every turn that there’s a part of me that’s like OH COME ON ALREADY is it really THAT good?!?!
I will say that I actually really like the styling of this generation. I don’t personally think it’s overdone at all. I’ve seen a few in person and they’re really attractive cars. They have classic proportions, the headlights and DRLs look great, they come in fun colors, and I think they have just the right amount of seasoning. Plus the additional power and less horrendous torque curve is a big positive…although is this thing really a reliability ace in the hole with a Subaru engine? I guess we’ll see.
Regardless I’d love to drive one but I won’t just go out and do it any time soon because I’m worried I might leave the lot in one and my wife would be extremely displeased if I rolled up in a manual coupe. Which brings me to the next downer when it comes to these…they’re amazing second cars but they’re hard to make work as a daily.
Your effort to move the front seat up and bring your daughter along is admirable, and I salute you. But this is a really hard package to make work unless you’re single or it’s just you, a partner/friend, and nothing else. I’m also once again going to ask a Japanese manufacturer for an automatic option that doesn’t suck ass. This package would be interesting with a DCT or ZF8…although I understand that manual is the obvious choice in a backroad carver like this.
Cool car for sure. My wife has said openly that she’d be down for us having a weekend car a few years down the road. Maybe Toyabaru and I will cross paths then…
From an owner: the “eliminated” torque dip is overstated. If this is what qualifies as gone, I would have truly found the original to be an undrivable exercise in frustration, though I am a low and mid range torque over high end power guy. Clutch feel is almost non-existent, flaccid standard Toyota (same as I remember from an ’80s Celica). Replacing the pedal spring helped a lot, but it’s still only “fine”. IMO, minus the electric steering* and triple-condom hydraulic clutch, this is more like a vintage car being produced to modern standards than a new performance car, which is exactly what I want, but people expecting a head-pressing rocket will be disappointed. It’s about having fun on your own terms rather than street racing or impressing others (though it does that when it’s parked—it gets a lot more attention than I expected, all positive, though mine’s also bright blue). It isn’t slow, though—I had a new WRX launching away from lights in front of me on a long stretch of unpopulated higher speed road and, on the second light, I rolled off the clutch like normal and saw him getting on it again, so I floored it to see how far he’d pull away. I was surprised when I had to back off a little in 3rd to not rear end him in spite of the casual rollout, then I just let him keep going as we were getting into a stupid speed. It might have been a CVT, IDK. I’m not sure if that’s testament to the GR or condemnation of the WRX.
I put two kids in car seats in the back when my friend’s minivan was broken down. That is emergency situation only! She’s a small ~5’4″ and had to be cramped to fit the 4 year old behind her. He’s too small to be able to bend his legs over the end of the seat, so they protruded out and I was pretty cramped as well with the older kid behind me, but at least he could bend his legs, so I could have the seat back a little farther, which I need as I’m 5’11”. The seats are really for storage and expanding the trunk space. In that regard, it fits way more stuff than I expected it could.
Reliability, IDK, I only have about 22k, so nothing to report there yet. No oil consumption out of the ordinary. I’m doing 6-7k changes as they’re so easy to do. I don’t want to write another whole page, but IMO, the RTV is an overblown nothing burger of confusion between correlation and causation by people looking to get warranty coverage after running multiple track days on the original oil in the summer or money shifting and trying to deny it even while laughably posting the ECU log they got from the dealer clearly showing 10k+ rpm.
A set of unequal-length headers will help a lot with the low and mid-range torque. Megan Racing are a great option. Combined with an Invidia exhaust, they sound amazing as well.
You were in your 20s for the Great Depression? Well, good on ya gramps for making it this far, let alone still being able to drive! Your daughter is probably pretty tired of still having to use a booster seat in her middle age, though.
Seriously though, I love that the GR86 exists. I kinda wish it was a little more “mature” in the looks department (I feel like the styling is aimed at people in their early 20s, whereas the people actually buying this new are probably mostly in their mid-30s to early 40s) but it’s not bad. That interior looks pretty dreary, but it’s livable. Does it come in a color other than Seasonal Depression Gray?
I don’t think either of those things would stop me from giving one a test drive though, if I were in the market for a sports car. The one to beat is still the Miata for me, mind you. I don’t see the back seats in the GR86 as being useful enough to be a big selling point; if you can get away with this as your only car then you could probably also get away with a Miata. Meanwhile, the Miata is a convertible and spirited driving is just so much more fun with no roof hemming you in.
Lol, that should be “recession”
I found the Miata to be a cramped mailbox I couldn’t even sit in comfortably (and I had plenty of room in a Saab Sonnet II), while the GR feels roomier as a driver—minus the obnoxious lower seat bolsters—than anything I’ve driven since they started jamming Hummer H1 center consoles into everything. The back seat folds down. I fit 8 tires inside—4 mounted on wheels. I wouldn’t want to live a weekend with a Miata, never mind transport stuff for work during the week, but so far anything that wouldn’t fit in the GR would also be too big to have fit in the 4-door hatchback it replaced. The biggest problem is getting stuff inside in the first place thanks to the shape of the trunk opening. When I picked up lumber and plywood (just 4×4 sheets), I had to load mainly from the passenger door. Same with the wheels. It does entertain people with trucks and low imagination in parking lots. I would never want to try to put a bike inside (especially where mine are too odd to fit), but I didn’t even like to do that when I had the hatches, so a hitch rack goes a long way, which I’m sure can also be found for a Miata.
I go on an MTB holiday every year, and slotting my bike in through the tiny trunk on the GT86 only takes a minute, once the wheels are off.
If it was a hatch I could take two bikes. I was hoping the GR would have a hatch.
Why does it seem all new cars have orange peel? Is it the new paint they use or something. I saw a brand new corvette and noticed it had orange peel too
Also, I wonder if they fixed the well documented RTV problem
There’s a good, long article about this here: https://newoldcars.com/orange-peel-why-your-new-car-paint-may-look-so-bad/
Thanks, that was a good read
That’s actually quite good indeed. Contrary to my comment below, they make a good argument that boils down to, “It’s expensive to fix, and customers don’t care.” Also, the now-universal use of water-based paints increases orange peel relative to the solvent-based paints of the past.
Good read but all I get is ” Its not a flaw because we are doing it on purpose to do things as cheap as possible to maximize profits”. Ie pickup trucks without rear bumpers and cars with donut spares or no spares at all.
Eeeeexcellent. A fun read and full of good stuff, including pointing out that concave surfaces show up orange peel more than concave surfaces. Since “flame surfacing”, large concave surfaces have become prevalent, so no wonder people are more conscious of orange peel.
It hides minor imperfections. The fact that it itself is an imperfection seems to escape the collective minds of car manufacturers, just like how covering everything in ugly black plastic is supposed to be a feature because it means there’s no pretty paint to scratch up.
If I was in the market for a new sports car this would be on my shortlist. Hell, if I wanted a used sports car it would be on there!
This is not a bad alternative to the Pony cars offered today. A bit of fun, comfy, and Toyota’s built proof reputation.